By Dennis Loo
By now we have nearly all heard about the raucous town hall meetings over health care. In the August 11, 2009 Washington Post, for example, Sen. Arlen Specter, meeting with the public in a Lebanon, PA town hall meeting, reproducing a similar scene that greeted him in Philadelphia last week, is this revealing excerpt:
"’You have awakened a sleeping giant,’ said Katy Abram, 35, a stay-at-home mother from Lebanon. ‘I don’t want this country turning into Russia, turning into a socialized country.’
“Specter fielded 13 questions before someone voiced support for the health-care reform efforts. Questioner No. 14, Marilyn Boogaard, said she was nervous to stand up and say something positive about Democrats’ health plan for fear of being booed.
"’I almost didn’t want to ask my question because it’s so intimidating,’ said Boogaard, 58, a nurse practitioner from Lebanon.”
At the town hall that Obama was going to attend, MSNBC reported:
“Outside the event where President Obama will conduct his town hall, there is an anti-Obama protestor with a gun — a pistol strapped to his lower leg.
“The local police chief said it’s legal for the man to have a registered handgun — as long as it is not concealed. What’s more, he is on private property, a church yard, which has given him permission to be there.”
On Friday Oklahoma Representative John Sullivan (R) questioned Barack Obama’s birth certificate’s authenticity at another town hall, further fueling and legitimatizing the moronic Birthers’ frenzy.
WTF?!
Some people look at all of this and think, “This is crazy.”
It is crazy, but there is a deadly underlying method to this madness. The intimidation and bullying, thuggish, atmosphere fueled by alarmist, fabricated, lying, and distorted propaganda from the organs of right wing extremists at Fox News, the Christian fascist movement and the motley crew of fascists working in collusion with the GOP leadership, are purposeful, engineered, and extremely dangerous.
As Marilyn Boogard cited in the Post article says, she was afraid to say something positive about the Democrats’ health care plan because of the lynch mob atmosphere being whipped up. This is remarkable if you think about it: at town halls, where polite discourse is the norm, people who support the majority party in Congress and the party that holds the White House are almost too scared to speak up in the face of worked-up- into-a-lather conservatives who think that Obama’s an illegitimate president, a socialist, and that the Democratic Party is chock full of traitors.
When a movement seeks to take power, they do so in steps. By this point all too many steps have already been taken to fascist norms. The transition from being afraid to speak up to being physically shut up is a short step indeed.
The following article, written before the Town Hall fracases, can be usefully read in conjunction with the very latest developments. While I don’t see it in every respect the same way, it makes must reading because of these fascist moves:
Is the U.S. on the Brink of Fascism?
By Sara Robinson, Campaign for America’s Future,
Posted on August 7, 2009,
“All through the dark years of the Bush Administration, progressives watched in horror as Constitutional protections vanished, nativist rhetoric ratcheted up, hate speech turned into intimidation and violence, and the president of the United States seized for himself powers only demanded by history’s worst dictators. With each new outrage, the small handful of us who’d made ourselves experts on right-wing culture and politics would hear once again from worried readers: Is this it? Have we finally become a fascist state? Are we there yet?
“And every time this question got asked, people like Chip Berlet and Dave Neiwert and Fred Clarkson and yours truly would look up from our maps like a parent on a long drive, and smile a wan smile of reassurance. ‘Wellll…we’re on a bad road, and if we don’t change course, we could end up there soon enough. But there’s also still plenty of time and opportunity to turn back. Watch, but don’t worry. As bad as this looks: no — we are not there yet.’
“In tracking the mileage on this trip to perdition, many of us relied on the work of historian Robert Paxton, who is probably the world’s pre-eminent scholar on the subject of how countries turn fascist. In a 1998 paper published in The Journal of Modern History, Paxton argued that the best way to recognize emerging fascist movements isn’t by their rhetoric, their politics, or their aesthetics. Rather, he said, mature democracies turn fascist by a recognizable process, a set of five stages that may be the most important family resemblance that links all the whole motley collection of 20th Century fascisms together. According to our reading of Paxton’s stages, we weren’t there yet. There were certain signs — one in particular — we were keeping an eye out for, and we just weren’t seeing it.
“And now we are. In fact, if you know what you’re looking for, it’s suddenly everywhere. It’s odd that I haven’t been asked for quite a while; but if you asked me today, I’d tell you that if we’re not there right now, we’ve certainly taken that last turn into the parking lot and are now looking for a space. Either way, our fascist American future now looms very large in the front windshield — and those of us who value American democracy need to understand how we got here, what’s changing now, and what’s at stake in the very near future if these people are allowed to win — or even hold their ground.”
The rest of this article can be found at AlterNet.
Truth: I am sorry that you took such exception to my summarizing what I thought was your argument by saying: “To describe the Town Hall protests as progressive overall is, however, a major mistake.”
Yes, you never used the term “progressive” anywhere, but you did criticize me for what you said was my demonizing the Town Hall protesters. I thus assumed that you meant that the protesters were doing good things and therefore I used the word progressive to capsulize that. Apparently, you regard that term as an insult. That’s not how I meant it. Here’s part of what you said initially that I was attempting to summarize:
“I’m surprised WCW posted this article, blasting the very people/movement that they should be supporting.
…
“Americans aren’t protesting just the health care bill. The health care bill is the last straw, but it is not the only issue. People are tired of yrs of gov’t usurpation of the Constitution. Of needless wars, of our rights being stomped on via the Patriot Act, Military Commissions Act, etc. They’re tired of the Federal Reserve Bank, a private, for profit corp. running the monetary policy of this country in secret & for their profit. They’re tired of seeing Congress pass bills without reading them. They’re tired of bankster bailouts & all the other corp. bailouts. They’re tired of having clean pure water & untainted food stripped away. They’re tired of seeing Congress pass bills despite the majority of The People opposing them. They’re tired of not being heard, yet made to pay for everything the thieves in Congress want for themselves & their corporate buddies. The health care bill is just the final straw in a long list of grievances.
“They’re tired of all the crap that’s been going on in this country for the last 20 years, & you post an article that demonizes them? SHAME ON YOU!!!”
What word you wish to use for this is up to you. I meant no harm and took it to be your meaning to call the protestors motivated for what you argue are good reasons “progressive.” If you prefer to describe them as conservatives, I have no problem with that.
The point I was making was based on what I thought was your point: that the Town Hallers were motivated for admirable reasons. Was that not your point? If it wasn’t your point, then please clarify.
You appear to think that by my using the left-right paradigm that I am being deliberately divisive and hypocritical or worse yet, an agent and an NWO pawn. Again, I assure you that this isn’t my intention or my role. If it is, I better go looking for a paycheck from them that I never noticed before. Certainly would help to make up for the cutbacks at my university!
I would agree that there are areas of overlapping agreement between some conservatives and some on the left. One of my major arguments here, however, which you haven’t really addressed is this: the Town Hallers’ objections that I have heard to the health plan are based on fabrications (e.g., that these are the actions of a socialist president and that he is bringing socialized medicine to America, that this is the opening wedge to turning the US into Russia, and so on.)
“To describe the Town Hall protests as progressive overall”
Stop putting words in other people’s mouths and then arguing those points. I never even used the term “progressive” once. Are you implying that the definition of “progressive” is to be anti-war? That’s pretty arrogant, isn’t it? Did it ever occur to you that the truly “conservative” position is, by it’s own “conservative” nature, anti-war and is very cautious when it comes to engaging in war? But of course, if you subscribe to the msm (mainstream media) lies of what constitutes “progressive”/”conservative” so as to divide and conquer The People, then of course, you’re going to spout the same non-sense to incite division amongst The People.
FYI: FOX is NOT sponsoring the protests – STOP SPREADING THE LIES THE NWO ELITES ARE USING by their control of all msm TO DIVIDE & CONQUER THE PEOPLE! STOP INSULTING PEOPLE BY MAKING ASSOCIATIONS THAT ARE BASED ON NOTHING BUT THE DESIRE OF THOSE WHO CONTROL THE MEDIA TO DIVIDE THE PEOPLE!! (GOD, ARE YOU EVER A BRAINWASHED IGNORAMUS!)
Or are you a NWO infiltrator, planted here to make sure that people do NOT find common ground? To foster hate and division so as to create conflict and more civil strife and wars? To ensure that they have a “justification” for martial law?
Your defiant, insulting attitude makes me think you are for surely, you’re not an intelligent man of Peace with the ability to see through all the hype.
“I don’t see any evidence” that you’re truly a person of Peace. Prove to me you’re a man of Peace, that you’re truly against division, strife, and warring.
What I do see is someone so entrenched in their left/right paradigm that they won’t bother to find the truth and would rather point fingers, and use insulting hate-inducing labels and false associations against their fellow countryman than find Truth and common ground. And you purport to be against wars? Well, in case you haven’t figured it out yet, your paradigm and behavior is EXACTLY what causes wars.
Hypocrites abound, and you’ve proven yourself to be one. For World Can’t Wait to allow such a close-minded person such as yourself to have a forum proves it is a FRAUD. You don’t care about Peace or creating an environment to foster Peace but would rather close your mind and hate your fellow man. SHAME ON YOU!
Instead of building bridges, you arrogantly turn a blind eye to Truth and repeat media spins – and you think you’re conveying something illuminating? Give me a break.. Anyone as close-minded as you is just a NWO pawn.
The world will find peace when selfish, arrogant, divisive spirits are finally silent, for stubborn, divisive behavior does NOT foster peace, but more war.
YOUR IGNORANCE, DIVISIVENESS & HYPOCRISY HAS BEEN EXPOSED.
I saw you at an anti-war rally once & let me assure you, I’ll not be going to any more where you’ll be. Nor will I be donating any $$ at WCW tables. I used to send notices of WCW events to my email list – won’t be doing that anymore either. I refuse to support hypocrites & frauds, no matter how “progressive” they purport to be, and I refuse to be the pawn of the NWO or its infiltrators.
Go sucker someone else into your “hate” paradigm.
Thank you Truth for your filling in some of the history behind the original Tea Parties.
The question here is this: what is the fundamental and overall character of a) the subsequent Fox sponsored Tea Parties, and b) the Town Hall Health Care Plan Battles? While it is important to recognize the overall progressive character of the original Tea Parties that 9/11 Truthers and then Ron Paul followers carried out, you haven’t spoken directly to the nature of the forces in the Town Halls.
I don’t see any evidence in the Town Halls that the kind of progressive elements are present that you describe for the original Tea Parties. Indeed, the evidence of the fascistic character and the outlandishly absurd and irrational proclamations from the shouters at these Town Halls is very clear. I’d be, again, happy to see evidence from you that this picture is more varied than that. I will add, as I said in my original comment directed mostly to Keesha (but also meant for you) that there ARE people who describe themselves as conservatives and constitutionalists who have some areas of overlap and agreement with those of us on the Left. To describe the Town Hall protests as progressive overall is, however, a major mistake.
Listen, I don\\\’t have time to keep coming back here to straighten your head out. You seem to be intelligent enough to know better. What you need to do is stop believing everything you hear without checking it out first, and stop hating & pointing fingers at everyone just because msm\\\’s given them a bad rap. Everyone connected to WCW should know all about that. And besides, don\\\’t you know it\\\’s not good to point fingers at others, \\\’cause when you do, there\\\’s 3 pointing back at ya.
Again, the mentality expressed in your article is a perfect example of why I left WCW.
The world is veiled with illusion right now. I hope one day you learn to decipher between illusion and truth, for therein lies Hope for humanity.
“If, as you say, many of the people at these town halls are against the wars then I would be happy to hear that. I would like more evidence of this from you. That is not the picture that I have been getting of these protests.”
Of course not! Msm is portraying what the NWO masters have told them to so as to divide & conquer The People of America! Come on, Loo, surely you can’t be so far in your left/right paradigm that you can’t see what’s going on.
Here’s a little history of recent protests: Tea Parties were first done by 911 Truthers about 2 yrs ago. Then Ron Paul supporters (who besides Kucinich, was a true peace candidate. FYI: a RP/Kucinich presidential ticket meetup group was started in CA back in ’08) started doing Tea Parties to protest the Iraq war, the Federal Reserve, & a whole host of issues in early Spring ’08. No one from any party asked us to do them. We decided to do them on our own, & the word spread amongst RP groups across the nation like wildfire & were held all across the U.S. And just as msm didn’t cover any of your anti-war protests, they didn’t cover any of our tea parties, either (or if they did, made you appear as “extremists” as they are doing to us now). I took footage of one in Santa Monica, CA where thousands of people went. We re-enacted the Boston Tea Party with declarations against the war & other items offensive to the U.S. Constitution & our liberty & threw crates with labels, including “Iraq War” off the pier. Don’t worry, all crates were captured. You can watch several Tea Party vids on YouTube.
Then Rick Santori made his comment in re to the bailouts. And when word started spreading about doing Tea Parties on 4/15/09, the Rep Party started covering it & tried to take them over, but in reality, RP supporters were on it way before Rick ever made his infamous outburst. We’ve been trying to get the word out that these protests are NOT a Rep Party deal, but belong to The People & are a spontaneous reaction to all the crap that’s been going on. Too bad you’re so plugged into msm. Perhaps if you did a little on-line research & got out & talked to people outside your left wing box you’d know what’s going on. It’s unfortunate that you haven’t done your homework, but have chosen to believe & parrot the very people who lie about the “peace movement”.
Many protestors are RP supporters, anti-war, anti-Fed, anti-MCA, anti-anything & everything unConstitutional. Problem is, far too many people don’t know what the Constitution says or what it’s really about. They think whatever they want, if they claim it’s their “right”, then the federal government is supposed to provide it for them. WRONG!
You have the right to Life, Liberty, & to pursue your own happiness, & so do I. We all share this “right” as long as we don’t harm others in the process. I, however, do NOT have the right to force you to provide whatever I decide will make me happy, & vice versa. If we do not possess this “right” as individuals, why would anyone think that if we get the federal gov’t to do the dirty work, then it becomes OK to forcibly take from others what we want for ourselves? It is the same as waging war on a nation to rape it of its resources, only instead of waging war on a nation for its resources, people wage war on their fellow countryman for whatever it is they want.
Once “charity” is forced, it’s no longer “charity”, but “tyranny”.
SHAME ON ALL WHO DO THIS!!
I’m sorry, after posting my comment I noticed two typos and I want to fix that here for clarity’s sake. So here following is the corrected version: :
Dear Truth: If, as you say, many of the people at these town halls are against the wars then I would be happy to hear that. I would like more evidence of this from you. That is not the picture that I have been getting of these protests.
The nature of political movements is that they are very complicated and a lot of different strains co-exist within them. I certainly recognize that there may be areas of overlap between the vociferous crowd members and WCW on matters such as the Patriot Act and the MCA. Populist movements can take on a lot of different shades, ranging from rightist to leftist tendencies and some of the same individuals can be drawn in very contradictory directions.
If the town hall shouting matches are examples of populism of a good kind, then I would be glad to learn this. I encourage you to elaborate upon these matters and we can get into it and sort through it all.
Dear Keesha: Obama’s plan is no good, agreed. The people who have been loudly condemning the plan, however, have been doing so on the grounds that he’s bringing socialism and they are entirely misguided on this. The point about the woman who was frightened almost to the point of not speaking up is that there is a right-wing wind being whipped up that bears the marks of fascist manipulation, not that she was too scared.
There is a trajectory to these events, of which this is a part, the assassination of Dr. Tiller is a part, the threats on people’s lives in Congress is a part, analogous to the earlier threats on Judges. This is not democracy we are seeing at work, although there is a thread of populism involved here. The people who have been organizing these protests, just like the Nazis, know how to weave good sentiments in with bad and lead people in the wrong direction overall. The Nazis’ anti-Jewish program was intermingled with an anti-bankers/anti-capitalist message. When they took power they liquidated those who had come forward on the anti-banker message as opposed to being anti-Jew.
Dear Truth: If, as you say, many of the people at these town halls are against the wars then I would be happy to hear that. I would like more evidence of this from you. That is not the picture that I have been getting of these protests.
The nature of political movements is that they are very complicated and a lot of different strains co-exist within them. I certainly recognize that there may be areas of overlap between the vociferous crowd members and WCW on matters such as the Patriot Act and the MCM. Populist movements can take on a lot of different shades, ranging from rightist to leftist tendencies and some of the same individuals can be drawn in very contradictory directions.
If the town hall shouting matches are examples of populism of a good kind, then I would be glad to learn this. I encourage you to elaborate upon these matters and we can get into it and sort through it all.
Dear Keesha: Obama’s plan is no good, agreed. The people who have been loudly condemning the plan, however, have been doing so on the grounds that he’s bringing socialism and are entirely misguided on this. The point about the woman who was frightened almost to the point of not speaking up is that there is a right-wing wind being whipped up that bears the marks of fascist manipulation, not that she was too scared. There is a trajectory to these events, of which this is a part, the assassination of Dr. Tiller is a part, the threats on people’s lives in Congress is a part, analogous to the earlier threats on Judges. This is not democracy, although there is a thread of populism involved here and the people who have been organizing these protests, just like the Nazis, know how to weave good sentiments in with bad and lead people in the wrong direction overall. The Nazis’ anti-Jewish program was intermingled with an anti-bankers/anti-capitalist message. When they took power they liquidated those who had come forward on the anti-banker message as opposed to being anti-Jew.
Thank you to Truth. I read the article and thought I\\\’d be the only one scratching my head. Good to know I\\\’m not.
For the participant who was scared, grow up. Democracy is loud and it\\\’s messy, it\\\’s not a tea or a social.
Good for the right for calling out Barack\\\’s nonsense plan. We should be calling it out on the left. Truth\\\’s exactly right, WCW has gotten stuck in a left-right frame where if the right objects we have to defend. There\\\’s nothing to defend in Barack\\\’s big give away to Big Pharma and the Insurance Companies.
Offer single-payer and I\\\’ll applaud him, I\\\’ll fight for it. I\\\’ll defend loudly and proudly.
But that\\\’s not what he\\\’s offering. He\\\’s a joke and WCW makes itself a joke.
I don\\\’t have sympathy for anyone who\\\’s nervous at a townhall. I\\\’m an African-American woman, I don\\\’t have time to tremble this society. I have to stand up. It\\\’s a shame WCW decided to play Mommy of the Nation instead of standing up.
I’m surprised WCW posted this article, blasting the very people/movement that they should be supporting.
Obviously, Loo & WCW are stuck in the Left/Right paradigm & can’t see that it is that very Left/Right paradigm that is tearing this country apart, pitting people one against the other, while the real criminals are getting away with doing whatever they want because people/organizations like you/yours are falling for their distraction tactics.
Americans aren’t protesting just the health care bill. The health care bill is the last straw, but it is not the only issue. People are tired of yrs of gov’t usurpation of the Constitution. Of needless wars, of our rights being stomped on via the Patriot Act, Military Commissions Act, etc. They’re tired of the Federal Reserve Bank, a private, for profit corp. running the monetary policy of this country in secret & for their profit. They’re tired of seeing Congress pass bills without reading them. They’re tired of bankster bailouts & all the other corp. bailouts. They’re tired of having clean pure water & untainted food stripped away. They’re tired of seeing Congress pass bills despite the majority of The People opposing them. They’re tired of not being heard, yet made to pay for everything the thieves in Congress want for themselves & their corporate buddies. The health care bill is just the final straw in a long list of grievances.
They’re tired of all the crap that’s been going on in this country for the last 20 years, & you post an article that demonizes them? SHAME ON YOU!!!
I used to be a supporter of World Can’t Wait. I removed myself about a year ago when I realized that your agenda is NOT really about understanding with depth & building bridges, but about pointing fingers & hating everyone & anyone who does not fall into your side of your paradigm. Believe me-THAT ATTITUDE NEVER LEADS TO PEACE, BUT ONLY TO MORE WARS!!
I went to your website to see what you’ve been up to, & this article has brought me great sadness. How sad to see your org. repeat lies & spins so full of hate for your fellow American. You should be supporting these people as many of them are against the wars, too. But instead of looking for & finding truth, you choose to be pawns of the hate/war machine that divides people, marginalizes them, so the powers that be can be “justified” in silencing & doing away with them.
No one’s contacted me from the Rep Party, or any group, to go to townhall meetings. No one’s offered to pay me to go. Yet 2 days ago I saw a job listing posted on Craig’s List-Sacramento, CA, offering to hire & pay people to go to townhall meetings & oppose ordinary citizens who are finally coming out to speak their mind. Yet the msm portrayal is quite the opposite & you fall for it. How utterly stupid for you to believe anything coming out of msm. Surely you must know that Dems voted for the wars, & voted to fund the wars that you supposedly oppose. The doo-doo on Clinton, Bush, Gore, Rumsfeld, Cheney, Pelosi, et al, is so deep!
You may have some awareness, but obviously you’re not looking at the whole picture clearly, & thus, are used by the hate/war machine.
BTW: Adam Kokesh, IVAW, is running for Congress. Here’s a quote off his website: “Not only is federal interference in healthcare unconstitutional, it is insulting to New Mexicans to say that we need to send money to Washington so they can tell us how to organize healthcare for our state.” – are you supporting him?