Rev. Deborah Elandus Lake is Executive Director of Sankofa Way Spiritual Services and Co-founder of the Chicago Chapter of The Interfaith Alliance. She is a graduate of Union Theological Seminary in NY, an ordained non-denominational minister, and serves on the Steering Committee of The World Can’t Wait. She has initiated a series of protests at Chicago churches against “using faith to justify the oppression of LGBT people” and written an article called “The Homophobes Are Out of the Closet! Bush Has Got to Go!”.
Interview conducted 6/8/06 by Debra Sweet.
DS: A lot of commentators said that Bush only came out for
the marriage amendment because he was trying to appease the Christian Taliban
of his base, who have been pushing him to act more decisively in opposition to
gay and women’s rights. What do you think?
Rev. Lake: I’ll start first by looking at the term “gay
marriage.” I tend to not use this term, because those against it, whether
they are gay or straight, can either say gay marriage is gay people asking for special
rights, or they can say that gay marriage mimics heterosexual marriage.
When I look at the history of marriage, I know that this is not
something I want to validate. No matter where we look, if we are honest,
the best we can say about the history of marriage is that it strengthened and
enriched two families, clans, or communities. The worst we can say is that it
legalized the ownership of women and children.
Now, supporters of the marriage amendment fail to talk about
how the institution developed throughout history. They don’t want us to think
about the fact that what we call marriage today developed from men claiming
women and children as property. In the west, marriage was the legal way men
took possession of women’s bodies and controlled their lives. That’s why, until
recent history, a man could not be convicted of raping his wife. That’s also
why a man could have his wife committed to a mental institution against her
will.
A general look at marriage from African and Native American
perspectives before the influence of Europeans, illustrates marriage as a way
of combining resources. Marriage was a way to empower communities, tribes, and
families, as they became united through the couple. For instance, war between
two tribes could end with the marriage of two people from opposing tribes. If a
woman’s husband died, her brother-in-law would take over the responsibilities
for her and her children.
In biblical terms, we see a combination of marriage as it
developed here and in the rest of the western world, and marriage as it developed
in African and Native American cultures. The needs of the community were more
important than the needs of the individual in Ancient Israel. Marriage was a
way of empowering and enriching two communities. Marriage was also how men
identified the women they owned and their children. This is why a man could
only be found guilty of adultery if the woman he slept with was married to
another man. In other words, a married man could have sex with another woman as
long as that woman was not another man’s property. This is also why a woman did
not exist outside the institution of marriage unless she had a son.
The bottom line is, even when we look at the Bible, the
source for the people who want to change the Constitution, marriage is not this
holy, sanctimonious, wonderful thing that God bestowed on His children so they
could go forth, be fruitful and multiply.
Bush, his supporters, and those who tell him what to do, saw
the conflict about marriage as a good way to divert the attention of people,
especially black people, from the decline of this country. The politicians
and religious bigots have latched onto something that has brewed and simmered
in black communities since before the Civil Rights movement.
With the rise of the Black Panthers, the pride of the black
man, and the rise in black male identity, came a rise in misogyny. Women were
meant to support the black man. We were meant to be subject to men and this
belief still exists in some communities even today. Just a couple of days ago
during one of our demonstrations, a black religious leader expressed his
disgust when he realized that black men were being lead by a woman. From overt
misogyny came overt homophobia. The author bell hooks does an exceptional job
of making the connection between black pride, misogyny, and the rise of
homophobia in black communities.
The Bush group’s political talent was in seeing homophobia
as a way to rally the troops, and the marriage amendment as a way to divert the
leaders of those troops. For instance in Chicago, the drop-out rate in high school for
black males is over 50 percent, but you don’t have people in the streets about
this. At one high school on the south side of Chicago, approximately 60 percent of the
students are HIV positive. People aren’t in the streets about this.
Instead, people are all worked up over what’s going on in
the privacy of one’s home between two consenting adults. Homophobia is a
way to gather black people in masses. Once black people are corralled, the
marriage amendment is how they divert attention away from the fact that they
are not as safe as we were five years ago. Or, the space between poor blacks
and the rest of the country gets wider with each year. Or, our children are
coming out of school unable to say or write a proper sentence. Or, unemployment
and underemployment is steadily rising. Or, HIV/AIDS is an epidemic in black America. Or,
the Catholic church is fighting the use of condoms in African countries where
HIV has taken an entire generation of people. The list of issues that actually
affect the quality of our lives is endless, and whether or not men and women
sleep together is not one of those issues.
In terms of marriage, we need to focus on the fact that
heterosexual couples are protected by and get financial rewards from our
government solely because their unions are legally recognized. The legal
recognition has nothing to do with what a particular religious tradition
teaches. That is why a couple can get married in 25 different religious
institutions and still not be legally married.
The fact is, lesbian and gay couples are living as second
class citizens in America,
and that must stop. The fact is, black lesbian and gay couples suffer the most
due to inequality in the laws because we tend to make far less money, and we
are more likely to have children. We need to stop bickering over who knows what
God wants, thinks, or expects, and enjoy the freedom that we already have to
believe what we want. We also need to put a stop to using religion to justify
making changes in laws or creating laws for everyone to live by.
I firmly believe this: religion has no place in politics.
I just as firmly know this: religion has corrupted the
political process.
In the late 1800’s what we now call the Pledge of Allegiance
was published. The words âunder God’ were not in the original version. Until
the 1950’s the Allegiance was:
‘I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America,
and to the Republic for which it stands: one nation indivisible, with liberty
and justice for all.’
Dwight D. Eisenhower, after a successful campaign led by the
religious group called the Knights of Columbus, approved the addition of the
words ‘under God.’ This was during the time of the House Committee on
Un-American Activities, blacklisting, and the McCarthy witch-hunts(another
frightening time in our country. I see this as one step in the direction that
brought us to the place where we are now, facing the legalization of a
particular style of religion.
I would like to see us begin to say the Pledge of Allegiance
in its original form as a way of protesting the misuse of religion in this
country. I would like to see all of our rallies and demonstrations begin by
reciting the Pledge of Allegiance as a way for us to begin to move our thinking
away from accepting a certain form of Christianity as the State religion. From
there we can begin to have an authentic conversation about human rights,
ethical standards, and equality.
DS: There is also a growing effort from the Christian
fascist base for legislation that you would have to be married to have support
for your child, for example bills introduced that a woman can only receive
child support from the state if she is married.
Rev. Lake: This debate is about religion. If we talk
about human rights, these people lose their authority. If we talk about
ethical standards, their pious veneer cracks.
For instance, the people who are pushing for laws that will
take control away from women, are the same people who are against birth
control, age appropriate sex education
in our schools, funding for domestic violence programs, and increases in the
budget for education. These people are pushing a political agenda that is based
on their religious beliefs. If we focus on ethical standards, and human rights
they will run for the cover of their religious rhetoric.
That is why we are encouraging everyone to sign the Stand
Now statement [link here[. We are saying that religious institutions should not
be in the business of influencing or making laws. Religious institutions are
free to believe what they want and teach anyone those beliefs as long as they
do not threaten the safety, well-being and civil rights of other people.
DS: What do you know about the connections of the rightwing
missionaries and the increase of gay-bashing in other countries?
Rev. Lake: In Jamaica, there’s a coalition of the
“unholy” working to undermine the efforts of lesbians and gays to obtain
safety and civil rights in their own land. A person can be killed or thrown in
jail for years just because he or she is gay. There is a group of black
preachers from the U.S. who
are either planning or have already gone to Jamaica to validate that
government’s anti-gay position. They are using the Bible to tell government
officials in Jamaica
that they have the divine right and the Christian duty to condemn
homosexuality. This is sacrilegious. This is using religion to influence
politics, and more people should know about what is going on.
DS: What direction is the Bush Regime going in the fascist
re-making society?
Rev. Lake: This regime will continue on its course on the
bodies of black, brown, poor, gay, lesbian, Muslim) people. Bush and the people who keep him in power,
believe in the Second Coming of Christ. They believe that chaos, destruction,
famine, and war are good (Rev. 8). They believe that they will be taken up
directly to heaven (Luke 17:34-37) and the rest of us will be left to gnash our
teeth. There is this fatalistic view in the government today, and young people
are looking for something better. They are looking for a way to believe that we
can make a difference and stop the direction we are heading.
Most of the people contacting me right now to join our
demonstrations are young people. Not just gay and lesbian, but youth
across the board. The established organizations that have made great progress
in the past are at a loss to address what is going on with Bush and company.
These organizations and political groups are not able to effectively stop what
is happening because they have become invested in the process and the process
is corrupt to the core.
Some have the mistaken belief that the Democrats will save
the day, and they have thrown their influence and resources to the Democrats.
What they don’t understand, is the Democrats and Republicans are locked in a
battle over who is the most religious and whose version of religion is best for
America.
Young people see this useless battle, and they know that
religion can’t be used to support and justify politics. There’s a huge core of
people who are 35 and under, and they are looking for leadership that is not
invested in business as usual. Young people are not finding this
leadership in the institutions that have worked for social change in the
past. These organizations are in bed with Democrats, and the Democrats are
in bed with the Republicans.
The mainstream organizations are not going to jeopardize
their money by supporting the fact that the entire system is corrupt and needs
to change. Their clout comes with their ability to toe the line. Their
political power is as strong as their ability to do just enough to raise a
stink, but not enough to make a change. Young people are tired and scared,
and they have connected to the “and allies” part of our
statement.
One man who protested with us last Sunday is very committed
to going into homophobic churches and talking to people there. He believes that
if he could sit down and reason with them, they would change their minds and
accept him. This is the approach many of us have taken and it does not work.
Trying to change the mind of a homophobe is a side argument, and it takes away
from the real problem. Religion is not the problem in our country. Religious
belief is not the problem in our country. Our problems come when people work to
legally establish a theocracy rather than legally ensure liberty and justice
for all.